Submitted by jcravens42 on April 6, 2008 - 12:05pm.

Please see the AWN advice pages regarding finding a job, as well as reading through the previous discussions in the "Finding a job" branch of the AWN forum.

Jayne Cravens
Bonn, Germany

Submitted by Gary on April 6, 2008 - 12:30pm.

Hi Pinkpetal,
Apologies for the previous bland and generally unhelpful reply to your request.
Unlike Jayne Craven, I won't insult your intelligence and direct you to somewhere that you've no doubt already visited.
Hopefully, I'll give you a more specific response to your question. No doubt that's why you came to the Aid Worker's Network in the first place to get some friendly, helpful, specific advice, am I right?
First of all, I'd register with the plethora of third sector/not-for-profit (NFP) agencies that we've got in the UK, i.e. CharityJOB, Guardian Jobs, Third Sector Jobs, etc, etc and sign up for their emailed updating service of job vacancies.
In addition to this, I'd do a google search for local to you charities/NFP organisations as well as bookmarking & visiting regularly the jobs pages of NGOs.
I hope this helps you.
Kind regards,
Gary Jenkinson

Submitted by myraidgoups on April 6, 2008 - 10:23pm.

Dear Gary,

Before making snide comments about Jayne's style of reply, you might actually want to have a look at those earlier threads. You would see that, far from insulting anybody's intelligence, her suggestion to look at earlier postings and the help pages was quite helpful for many earlier posters who had not done so before posting here.

Best regards,

Submitted by Gary on April 6, 2008 - 11:37pm.

Hello Michael,
Thank you for comments.
Definition of Snide:
snide [snīd]
(comparative snider, superlative snidest)
derisively sarcastic: derisively sarcastic
[Mid-19th century. Origin ?]
-snidely, adverb
Microsoft® Encarta® 2007. © 1993-2006 Microsoft Corporation. All rights reserved.
Yes, I plead guilty to this!
Why? Because I felt Jayne Craven's response went against the very ethos that AWN is all about, i.e. friendly, helpful, informal advice willingly given to those who have requested it.
Whilst I very much agree that looking at previous posts is a very useful place to start researching, and yes, it is annoying when some folk obviously can't be bothered to and post a request instead, it also doesn't hurt to answer a specific request either.
It would be interesting to know from Pinkpetal which of Jayne's or my posts she found the most helpful.
BTW, why are you jumping to Jayne Craven's defence for? If she was offended by my remarks isn't it for her to say something to me, or to a site moderator? What has it got to do with you, may I ask??
Gary Jenkinson

Submitted by myraidgoups on April 7, 2008 - 12:11am.

Hello Gary,

Yes, I am aware of the definition of 'snide' (although, living in Australia, I tend to use the Macquarie Dictionary instead of Encarta) and used the word advisedly.

Let's start with your last three question. For one, I was not 'jumping to Jayne Craven's defence' (who is perfectly well able to take care of herself), but to the defence of this community, of which I am an active member. Self-admitted snide comments are not helpful and do not add anything positive to the community's atmosphere. They did not add anything useful to your posting either.

I have no clue whether or not Jayne was offended, but as I said I was not defending her, so that is neither here nor there.

And what it has got to do with me: I am an active part of this community, and as such I had my sensibilities offended by your remarks -- and hence it definitely has something to do with me. Now you could argue that your posting was not directed at me so I should not take exception to it, but in that case, why did you react strongly to Jayne's words, which in that same line of reasoning would have had nothing to do with you?

As to the ethos of AWN and whether or not Jayne's reply was offending against that ethos: I would suggest that you re-read my first reply. You would see that I argue that her answer has been quite helpful in a majority of similar postings, and that hence chances were that it would be quite helpful in this case as well -- and thus perfectly well fits in with that ethos; an ethos, I might add, which Jayne haa helped create in the first place.

Finally: which post was most useful in Pinkpetal's eyes is irrelevant. I don't argue that your posting was not useful for Pinkpetal (in fact, I would suspect that it was), but that the first two sentences did not add to its usefulness at all but only served to injure this same community ethos that you seem to value so highly.


Submitted by Gary on April 7, 2008 - 12:26am.

If you've been offended by my remarks, all I can say is you've got an awfully thin skin mate and you're in the wrong job.
Grow up!
With the very best of wishes, dearest Michael.
Gary Jenkinson

Submitted by myraidgoups on April 7, 2008 - 12:37am.

Hello Gary,

How about sticking to the substance of what I am saying instead of attacking me personally? You might also want to leave judgements about whether I am in the wrong job to people who actually have worked with me and know what they are talking about.

I would also suggest that this latest posting is more injurious to AWN's ethos and atmosphere than any that have gone before. Consequently, you might want to reconsider your earlier remarks on this subject.

I am eagerly awaiting your reply to my arguments, not my person.


Submitted by Gary on April 7, 2008 - 10:51am.

Dearest Michael,
Stop being so precious and just grow up!
IMHO the simple fact of your use of the term (argumentum) ad hominem in your subject line only goes to show what a pompous pratt you are.
You obviously have far too much on your hands and I'd recommend find something productive to do that could be put to use for the benefit of your fellow man - Goodness, there are more than enough in this world in need of help!
If you don't like my comments, fair enough, but PLEASE don't try and prolong the agony for the rest of us having to read your nauseous twaddle!
I have no desire WHATSOEVER to enter into further futile discussion with you and this will be my LAST post in reply to you - I've got far more important things to do!
With bery best wishes,
Gary Jenkinson

Submitted by jcravens42 on April 7, 2008 - 12:39pm.

And what a pleasure it is to be greeted on this fine, rainy day by such a friendly exchange!

Michael ("myaidgroups"), thanks for trying to "defend" me, based on what you have seen from my past behavior on AWN. I guess it's time for me to learn more about you, since we've never met. I'll unleash Google right after I post this.

For anyone else following this enchanting thread: it's standard procedure on any online community when a frequently asked question is asked yet again to direct the user to existing information. The AWN site isn't the easiest to navigate, and often, people post questions without being aware that answers to their questions already exist. I gave what I thought would be the clearest, quickest route to the answer. And I'll continue to do this, so as not to bog down the community with the same answers again and again.

And as for Gary -- wow, are your posts here an example of providing "friendly, helpful, informal advice willingly given to those who have requested it"? Because, clearly, I have a different definition of such.

Jayne Cravens
Bonn, Germany

Submitted by myraidgoups on April 8, 2008 - 12:10am.

My apologies.

Submitted by myraidgoups on April 8, 2008 - 12:08am.

Hi Jayne,

Probably the easiest place to start is at at LinkedIn (my full name is Michael Keizer; full profile to be found at You could also ask fellow AWNer Warren Keen, who knows me IRL. BTW: let me know what you came up with Googling (apart from my model powerboating namesake).

BTW: as I wrote earlier, I was not trying to "defend" you as I think that you are perfectly able to do so yourself.

After Gary's latest post I have decided that I am going to leave well enough alone. I think he has made his position and attitude clear enough;this doesn't need any further amplification from my side.


Submitted by tarble on April 10, 2009 - 2:10am.

Have you met with success from the assistance provided through the respondents? They may like to know how you did...

Kind regards, Tom

Submitted by seychelles on December 8, 2010 - 11:03am.

Interesting discussion. I've found this thread quite inspiring from my little corner of the world. Happy holidays and hope we all get the jobs we deserve and share each other's successes and help to make lighter their failures. Cheers...

My preferred beach in Seychelles has fine white sand, deep blue sea and great budget hotels. Check out Praslin hotels for your beach holiday

Submitted by ulumma on December 9, 2010 - 10:36am.

I tink thats the best way to end it,dear seychelles.i was a little bit confused, considering where to make coments, untill u looking forward to the holidays and better oportunities in the coming year.

Submitted by ankhkare on March 10, 2011 - 8:04pm.

We are all looking for a job nowadays with this financial crisis going on, but, unfortunately, we don't find anything.
But, if you find one, you should know that you need peo services. We can all take care of ourselves, but there are a lot of times when we don't have access to some information and this kind of services can really help.

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